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Gun Reports - News
U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder says Congress is in part to blame for illegal guns in Mexico because of its hostility to gun control.
AG Eric Holder blames Congress
for flow of illegal guns into Mexico
November 14, 2011
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(GunReports.com) -- The Obama administration has warned that the US is "losing the battle" to stem the flow of weapons from American guns shops to Mexican drug cartels responsible for tens of thousands of killings, and gunowner's representatives in Congress are partially to blame.
The U.S. attorney general, Eric Holder, told a Senate hearing that Congress is in part to blame because of its hostility to gun control, even going so far as to try and block federal law enforcement agencies from requiring gun shops to report multiple sales of automatic weapons.
Holder described as "flawed" American attempts to break the cycle, in which the profits from selling illegal drugs in the US are used to buy guns that are shipped across the Mexican border to the cartels which use them to protect their operations.
"We are losing the battle to stop the flow of illegal guns to Mexico," said Holder.
The attorney general said that federal authorities suffer from a "lack of effective enforcement tools" including tougher legislation to prosecute gun traffickers and funding for teams of agents to combat weapons smuggling.
Tighter laws are opposed by the National Rifle Association gun lobby, which wields considerable influence in Congress, as infringements on the constitutional right to bear arms.
Read more here..
"The attorney general said that federal authorities suffer from a "lack of effective enforcement tools" including tougher legislation to prosecute gun traffickers"...so that means the AG is going to prosecute anyone who is responsible for smuggling guns into Mexico, right? Good news, so when does Holder get sentenced? Eric Holder was sentenced the day he was sworn in. His sentence is to a life surrounded by dishonest, lackluster politicians that can't even place blame correctly. I think he receiving his just punishment. He probably keeps a bottle of Maalox in his briefcase...... Holder-you can kiss my ass, the only threat I'm worried about are socialist gun banners like you and your stinking ilk! what a crock, hell no America can not stop the flow of guns to mexico if the federal governments backs their trucks up to the borders and dumps the "guns" over the border line into mexico. any fool could figure that out except our federal employees. holder and his buds need to be removed from office for failure to uphold the constitution they swore to uphold when taking office. how do we as American citizens make this happen. who do we got to to fill out the paper work that will bring charges against these rascals? i'll sign the f_ _ _ _ ng papers if some one will tell me which ones. What a FRIGGIN MORON. Want to stop the little as it REALLY is flow of weapons into Mexico? BUILD A REAL BORDER & STAFF IT WITH PROPER PERSONAL. How about this for an idea. Since the OTHER MORON (this one in the White house) is pulling all the troops from Iraq, lets declare war on the cartels. Tell the Federales to stand aside, we are going to tale out the Cartels. What can they do against a squadron of B-52s about to carpet bomb them into never never land? Lets see how tough Juan Valdez is against an armored battalion! WIPE THEM OUT. We won't even charge Mexico to do their vermin extermination. I'm with you, M_E_. While we are at it, we should annex Mexico and make it part of the U.S. Then our southern border would be considerably smaller and easier to patrol. Why try to stop it? We are the biggest arms dealer in the world. Jobs, jobs, jobs. Holder has no integrity and no credibility. Of course, neither does his idiot boss. Get rid of them both. This administration is getting more and more laughable every time it says something about the border and guns. On the one hand, the DOJ and BATFE are actively supporting the flow of illegal firearms into Mexico, while on the other hand they decry the ease with which firearms flow into Mexico. Then we hear about how difficult it is to control the flow of illegal immigrants across the border while at the same time, refusing to enforce immigration laws and protect the border. What a f-----g bunch of morons! Admit nothing, deny everything, make counter-accusations. Holder's audacity is ridiculous... The SMOKING GUN of TREASON. Eric HOLDER only did what the Obama puppet "holders" wanted. The Fast & Furious operation was DESIGNED to ONLY record the sales here in USA and then watch for the guns to show up in Mexico. That is why there was NO PROVISION to track the guns and why any agent that wanted to do so was told to stop. It is very clear that the object of this Obama plot was to create the fiction of a CRISIS so they could release this current campaign about more gun controls. Eric Holder, Osama Obama, and the Field Chiefs that conducted this plot should be AT LEAST charged with aiding and abetting the murder of not only USA citizens but Mexican Citizens as well. They might also be guilty of TREASON as they have conspired to attack the USA and the Constitution (Bill of Rights) by their plot. As a retired Military & Civilian Intelligence Officer, I find this plot to almost be self convicting to all involved. The GROUND TRUTH is there to bring charges against them. there are a number of GROUND TRUTH listed on the internet. some do not appear to have the same goals as "we do". could you be more specific as to which GROUND TRUTH you are referring to HACK43? I would like to bitch slap that smirk off of his face. This is all just venting we need to band together and vote ob out and get some one in that will restore our rights!!! Only when the people in dc do what we the people tell them to do will we win. i agree with fred 45. America needs to stop pissing around and do something definitive. if we do not, soon we will not be able too. i love the line in the movie "Open Range" by costner, "there are worse things than dying". our freedom has been bought and paid for by an uncountable number of brave Americans who have died to keep us free. there will probably be more who will die keep us free. that is what costner is saying, it's better to die fighting for freedom than to be executed because America lost it's freedoms. think about it, it's your grandkids you are saving. I can hardly wait for Holder's next bit of revisionist history--the Holocaust was caused by the Jews. Here we go again, this dysfunctional administration is pointing the finger at the other guy in stead of taking responsibity for their screw up Man am I glad I don't make enough money any more to get "gang audited" by the IRS. As The Colonel stated, I am sure we are all on the gov't shit list and all of this is being archived for the day they kick out doors in. I will did protecting my puppies. I am my own man and NOT affiliated with any internet organization. "GROUND TRUTH" is an Intelligence Term and refers to the ACTUAL SITUATION ON THE GROUND, not from some (as my cousin COL David HACKWORTH called it) "Pentagon Princes" making thoughtless comments supplied by their staff. I could never be a MODERN staff officer because "I lack the clarity of vision unencumbered by reality or experience" that is so necessary in this politically correct civilian and military world we live in. I salute you Hack as I do all our military heros. Col. Novack is a ret. USA chopper pilot and comments in here very eloquently, I might add. I am always thankful to hear comments from guys that have had their asses in the grass. Thank you. JUST A NOTE: This HOLDER operation worked as it was intended and they still are trying to follow through with their "ban the firearms" plot as directed from their "Casa Blanca" lawyer & thief. Well, as I always say, the government can't pave f*****g roads, so why would we not expect this Fast & Furious thing not to turn out to be a Chinese Fire & Boat Drill. Holder's claims are a typical ploy of attorneys and propagandists and politicians (the bastard children of the first two with corporate CEOs). You first ignore the situation at hand - felony violations by the authorities in this case - and then blame the problem on 'lack of sufficient controls' by the agencies. The hope is to a) deflect attention from the felony accusations and b) get even more power and control for the very agents who are violating the law in the first place. What an ass! Blame everyone else, you sorry SOB! Well, of course, "blame everyone else". That has been the modus operandi of the Obama administration since inauguration day back in January 2009. Never in my life time have I been witness to a more devious presidential administration. We have seen transgressions come and go in the Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and Bush administrations, but never have I seen so much subterfuge, finger-pointing, and outright lying as I am now seeing in the BHO administration. This has got to change! I must have missed a point or two along the way. Why do we, as citizens,allow this cheap crap from the likes of Holder and Obama?. Why not get rid of them and make sure they never come back? PLEASE vote Nov. 2012 It really is up to us, not them.....bottom line Semper Fi I have to say that even the Bush administration didn't seem to blame anyone else as much as BO's does. With Bush it was usually wait a week and then say "why are we still talking about that? That's old news. Let's move on.". Even when he was found to be violating FISA law on a nearly daily basis, all he said was 'Yeah, I did it and I'll do it again if I want to.' They just refused to discuss a lot of things, instead of trying to blame somebody else. You need to remember the term "Presidential Signing Orders". I am sure all of you know of them. Bush used them more than all the presidents combined before him but no one mentions how many times O has used them. By the way, a question. Does anyone have a collection of MRE's and if so, what type and a brief synopsis of their edibility, please. I don't have any MREs but I may still have some dry C-Rations condiments. I used LRPRs (AKA: "Lurr-Ps") but most C-Rations. I had to open the case from the bottom so no one could see the labels and cherry pick the best meals. This also promoted some serious trading and avoided fighting over the food. Bargaining/SELF-CONTROL exercise for my team. The American Plains Indians had the BEST combat rations: "Pemmican". It was easy to store and some are reported to have lasted over thirty years without spoiling. This was probably longer than the tribe lasted with the Yankee Army genocide against them after the US Civil War (or as my Grand Mother called it “The War of Northern Aggression”.) Both of my Great-Great GrandFathers were Texas Cavalry in the Civil War. Cecil, there is a reason that MREs are often described as Meals Rejected by Ethiopians. Cs aren't all that bad, but are getting ancient now. A rotating supply of modern canned and dried foods, or the do-it-yourself equivalent, ought to solve any need quite adequately. And Hack, my Great Grandfather also served the Confederacy and Louisiana (as did a whole generation of other relatives) in the War Between the States. It is my fervent hope that the current divisions in this country can be resolved by reasoned debate without a renewed use of arms. But those divides are getting deeper. WOW guys, I am impressed. I don't know about any of my relatives and that conflict as my Dad was adopted, although there is some evidence that he was part Cherokee. I am stilled pissed about the way the South was treated and the way history has been re-written to make us believe that it was all about slaves. I am also pissed about how we treated the Native Americans. And actually, we still don't do them right. But HACK, I love that Meals Rejected by Ethiopians line. Fastest animal in the world: an Ethiopian chicken. Thanks for the info in the MREs guys. I think I will stick with the canned goods but I have not a clue as to making Pemmican. Cecil - try looking for comparable products via places like The Sportsman's Guide or Cabela's. I am told that Meals Ready to Excrete have improved greatly since they were a routine part of my subsistence. (I think that means they added ethnic meals and more candy.) If you go that route, you should keep in mind the nutritional design of the MRE is geared for very high activity levels, and they don't have much fiber. The cold weather rations were far superior in taste, but also had a ton more calories. Cecil, I didn't mention the "Ethiopian connection", Visigoth52 did. However, I KNOW C-Rats can spoil. I got SURVERE food poisoning from a can of "Beef Stew" (one of the better meals). By the way, those C-Rats cans made the best grenade holder for a trip wire drop along a trail. This was a smaller “IED” inside a can which went up to the 55-gallon drum and larger. We were trained to build these back in the OLD pre-1970s SF before all the high tech demo stuff. TRY this link for PEMMICAN preparation: http://www.natureskills.com/wild-foods/recipe-pemmican/ The Indian squaws hand-rolled each bit of meat with fat and berries. I also remember something about them chewing something in the process. This process is a lot like making sausage or maybe even old Aunt Gertrude's rock-solid holiday "fruitcake". Just remember "if it doesn't kill you, it will make you stronger". But be careful, maybe I am confusing this sage advice with the bad/good experiences from my first serious girlfriend (or was it the second or third or....?). Thanks HACK. I will check it out and see if it doesn't kill me. LOL So you were a SF guy. Man, my hat is off to all of you Vets. Col. Novack flew choppers in the Nam. All I did was schlep bombs on a merchant ship. AND you went to Ethiopia. I am still pissed off about the 18 Rangers we lost there and didn't bomb the shit out of them for it. Of course, I am still pissed off about the 243 Marines in Beirut and Col. Higgins and just a whole lot of crap that our government has done wrong. But you guys are MY heros. Thanks. Cecil This is what obeyme and holder and hellery have all been working for, when obeyme told the Brady bunch he was working on take our guns under the radar,Hellery with the UN and small arms treaty, they are all accessories to muder. Personally I have little to no experiance with MRE's but lots with C rations and some K rations, and like Hack said the cans made great booby traps with a grenade, You can also use some cans from can goods from what we can buy from the store now. Also you can use these cans with out a grenade if you now what nd how to do it and what to use. Back to food smoked dry fish and jerky are best long lasting foods, also reseable pouches of salt, pepper, and other seasonings and spices, will help get past the taste of some gridders that don't taste so good but will keep you alive. God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out Of the US I will forever be grateful to my parents for having raised me in a relatively austere environment. We were comfortable, and we had what we needed. Our clothes were stylish, but we didn't get all of the latest fads. I was taught to eat whatever my mother cooked, and she often came up with some really odd dishes. Nonetheless, while I might have wanted a bit more than what we had, I am very thankful today, for that upbringing back in the 1940s and 1950s..... There isn't anything.....I mean anything.....that I won't eat, unless it jumps off the plate before I get to it. As the father of six sons, it used to piss me off to no end that they had the gall to pick at food and complain that they didn't like it. Well, now that they are all out there on their own, it's very interesting to see what they will settle for, now that they are paying for it. I hear you Colonel. My Dad was an E-6 for many, many years because of being an aircraft mechanic in the Air Force and the career field was frozen. Go figure that one out. Anyway, there were 5 kids and we ate whatever my Mother put on the table and didn't pick at anything. The younger folks are in for a rude awakening I fear. And Bear, thanks for the input. I have started putting things in those vacuum bags, one of the few things I have purchased in my life that has a great use. Not sure that Obama can bullshit us up a pine tree with this UN treaty thing. It still has to pass the Senate and I don't think even those idiots would sign off on it. But one can never tell. I know that treaty or not, they will not get MY guns unless they try to take them. Then, that is a whole other story. Red Dawn all over again. canovack and CecilS, I to had a familly of 3 brothers and a down syndrom sister and things were hard even in the 50's and 60's for us, when mom put food on the table we ate it no if ands or buts, or go hungry, us older boys took what jobs we could find to help out with familly bills and our school cloths, I even worked as a greese monkey assitantor or camp cleaner for logging outfits, also worked on my unclescattle ranch for room and found and pay (small) but pay that went to my mom for safe keeping. As for the vacum seal machines I use one of them also, sure are handy for all kinds of stuff. Don't for get pine nuts are good eatin too. Also growing up with the Native Americans I learned alot that helps out. God Bless America and out Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the Un Out of the US i think a lot of us have seen some hard times Bear. BUT, we did survive didn't we. I seal lots of stuff to keep out dry rot, like my gas mask and the filters. Growing up with Native Americans was probably a very neat experience. We sure screwed over them though. Trying to keep my powder dry. Respectfully, Cecil Cecil S, I have to say that what I leared from the Native Americans and growing up with them is more than likly one of the reasons I made it through my tour in the Nam. The learning of movingthrough the woods and not making a sound and blending in and getting rit of my sent where most likly the most emportant. These things along with alot of others I am very thankful for and for the Great American Natives. God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out of the US My folks were 'depression children', and that lesson stuck with them all their lives. I'd seen my dad put soured milk on cereal, not knowing it was bad - and then eat it anyway because he didn't want to toss out 'good cereal'. At the time I though he was crazy. But life has taught me a few things. Now, I'll eat anything that doesn't smell 'off'. If it's old, well so am I and I'll eat it anyway. (I can hear somebody laughing already....) If you show me something a tribe of 20 people somewhere eat regularly, I'll try it. I've cooked and eaten groundhogs, chipmunk, snake, pigeon, and a few other odd things. Most aren't too bad. I'm actually interested in trying these flying asian carp that are spreading all over the place. Carp from clean running water are quite tasty - close I'd say to cod - if you remember to remove the mud vein. I used to shoot them in streams with my bow. Yeah, I've eaten a few carp in my youth. I even remember one fishing trip with my dad back in the late 1940s on Long Island, NY. We lived in Mineola at the time, and we went fishing at Babylon and caught a mess of puffers. These are the cute little fish that inflate, making themselves look like prickly little balls when they are frightened. We took the whole mess of them home and filleted them, cooked them, and ate them. They were pretty good, but later we found that they have a little gland in their heads that secrets a pretty strong poison. We must have done something right, because we never experienced any ill effects from that meal. hmmm, I thought this was a discussion about AG Holder? Colonel, you never told us you were a Yankee. LOL The MM Academy is in Great Neck, so I have been to Mineola a few times. Haven't tried carp but then I am not a fisherman. But I have seen that jumping carp film and wonder why people coudn't eat them. Does anyone know anything about how long you can keep canned goods past their expiration date and eat without dying. It seems to me that all this dating of foodstuffs is scaring the crap out of everyone. If it is vacuum canned, what can go wrong? I know not to eat something from a swelled can but sometimes I think we over react. Of course, I have been wrong many, many times in my life. By the way, I looked up How To Make Pemmican last night. I would say it needs lots of salt and pepper. I am also wondering how long one could keep Jerky if it was sealed in a vacuum bag. Am I getting crazier? One more question for you Vets and I will leave you alone. Can you tell me, to solve my curiosity, how many rounds of 556 stuff, the average grunt carries with him on a patrol? I would probably give up the spare underwear to carry a shitload of ammo but that's just me. Thanks Cecil Cecil, since most of my combat in Vietnam was from the air, I cannot vouch for the validity of my response, but somewhere in the murky depths of my cerebrum I seem to remember that 200 rounds was a basic load. We were still using 20-round magazines when I was in-country, and that equated to ten full magazines in ammo packs or on bandoleers. With the advent of 30-round mags, and with the statistical rate of a few thousand rounds per individual kill of enemy personnel, I'd imagine that today's grunts are carrying quite a bit more ammo than back in my day. Maybe there's a recent combat veteran out there who can provide some up-to-date information. Oh, by-the-way joburge, we have pretty well discussed Holder and company, so we have taken the opportunity to exchange some interesting and practical information. Those of us who have been in this forum for several years sorta get that way..... Thanks Colonel. That 200 round fact was stuck back in my head somewhere but then I heard some statistics that we expended 50,000 rounds per KIA in the Nam. So, I am thinking that these kids in Afghanistan are humping lots more ammo these days. By the way, I watched that "Viet Nam in HD" again last night and all I can say is, shit. When you watch it as opposed to "Platoon" or "Full Metal Jacket" you sure get a different perspective. It was a real shitstorm for you guys and I will always feel guilty that I didn't join the Marines and go. Not to worry Cecil..... The bombs you "schlepped" were much appreciated. Just think.....your fingerprints might have been on a hunk of bomb casing that ripped through some VC or NVA guys who were humping shit on the Ho Chi Min Trail..... Cecil, if my memory surves me right, it all depended on how long we were out, an the reports on how many possible enemy we might encounter out in indian territory. Usualy it was ten 20 round mags. Some of us though would try and grab at least one extra bandoleer of 5 to ten mags or even a couple of bandoleers of ammo on stripper clips and then pray to god we didn't have to be in the crap bad enough to have to go to them. Because if you are haveing to pull mags and reload them with stripper clips your in some real deep crap. The reason alot of us wanted the weighter M14 was it didn't take a hole mag to cut down the bush Charlie was behind, but one or two rounds did the job. I didn't watch Vie Nam in HD because it would bring back to many bad memories that I don't need. But I would like to say Thank You for your service because with out the Fly Boys things would have been alot worse for us one the ground.God Bless You. God Bless Ameica and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US out of the UN and the UN Out of the US Thanks guys for your kind words. I tried to do my part but you guys were the ones with your asses the grass and you will always have a place in my heart. Glad that you all made it out alive. ONE SHOT, ONE KILL is the goal with 7.62 NATO or AKA: .308 Winchester. Preferred the AK-47 to SPRAY the area. Plenty of AK ammo available after a few rounds of .308 were fired. I got an AK simply because it is a throw away firearm but pretty reliable. And there is a ton of ammo around and it is cheap. When the SHTF day, you just pop a cap in the ass of some gang banger and take his ammo. At least that is plan A. LOL My original plan was to keep the variety of calibers to a minimum, so I try to stay with 7.62x51mm (.308). However, I recognized that a plenitude of ammo exists in 5.56x45mm (.223) and 7.62x39mm as well, so I try to keep my rifles in those three calibers.....but I do have others for which I don't stockpile as much ammo. I haven't been able to discipline myself to stay in any particular handgun caliber, but my favorites are .45 ACP and .357 SIG. That said, I am presently having a wild and abandoned love affair with .45 Colt, and recognizing the plenitude of 9x19mm that exists, I have a number of pistols in that caliber. Anything in .357 Magnum is also a big turn-on as well. For me, 12 gauge is the most adaptable of the shotguns, although I have one of those cute little Circuit Judge revolving carbines that handles .45 Colt and .410x3". Well, damn it, sometimes I stray into lots of other calibers and gauges, because I just like the pieces that eat those rounds. I know what you mean. I almost bought one of those Circuit Judges myself but talked myself out of it. Hell, I only have 2 hands and my dogs refuse to learn to shoot. I too have stuck with the 556 and 762x39 and one to reach out there a distance. My handguns (with which I am more proficient) stays with .44, .45, 9mm and my old service .357. Shotguns too as you. My analysis is to try to keep the different ammo to a minimun, just in case we have to move West ahead of the Zombies. I must say, to brag a bit that I can punch buttons with my "Dirty Harry" special. You ex military guys were trained well with the long guns, while the cops train with the hand guns. But, I do understand about keeping your enemy as far away as possible. Wish I had a TAC 50 but I couldn't afford the ammo. By the way guys, does anyone know WHY you can't eat a Javelina? I am sure it would be a bit gamey and no doubt tough, but after Zombie Day, anything might taste good. AND did you see the paper today. Texas Parks & Wildlife is killing the wild donkeys in Big Bend. I wish I had a place to trap and keep them. Might not be gasoline one of these days. But what really pisses me off if, what did donkies ever do to deserve to be slaughtered? Sometimes I think man just likes to kill animals for the sake of killing animals. On our FIRST date my wife fed me a really "ratty" tasting Javelina that she had shot. It tasted like that because it is a large rodent, not a pig. The Javelina run in packs on the AZ desert around Fort Huachuca and the pack that attacked my wife's dogs in her front yard were shocked to get the DIRTY HARRY S&W .44 MAG as a reward. I politely said the rat was very good but I was really impressed by how she harvested the critters. Despite this romantic linkage, I HIGHLY recommend that you avoid Javelina on you game list. Feed it to the dogs unless it is down to the dogs or the Javelina. Bon Appetite! By the way, my choice for ammo standardization is a. Rifles: .308, 30-06, & 700 WIN MAG and b. pistols: .45 ACP, .45 ACP, & .45 ACP. I still carry a "NM/SPEC-OPS" M1911 made by the REAL Springfield Armory in 1915. Thanks for that info on the Javelina? But you still married her after she fed you a rat? LOL I too love my .45. And I shoot it pretty well. I hear that the Delta Force guys carry them because they think (as do I) that the 9mm is sort of a pussy gun. I do personally know that you can't get a pimps Daddy stopped by shooting the tires with a 9mm just as a .380 won't pierce both glasses in an old phone booth. The ricochet will make said turd leave the booth however. By the way RAT tastes BETTER than Javelina. I tasted the rat (and more) while completing the Jungle Warfare School in Panama back in those wonderful 1960s. While I was "Waiting by the Dock of the Bay" with Otis (although he was already dead before they released his recording (like so many of my friends from those years). I don't think I ate RAT in Panama but it was SOMETHING with hair on it. Great place for p***y. Well I guess I will have to one of two things. Make a stand for awile an take alot down then move out or send some ahead and follow keeping their heads down and making them wish they hadn't buy becomeing a Dog solder, untill we can fort up, because I have alot of stuff from .22,22mag up to 30-06, including 223 and 7.62 x39, even nice little lever .357mag. As for hand guns .22,.22mags..38, 357mags.380,s&w40,s and 45acps, as for shotguns got 20 and 12 gauges. Lots of ammo for each and getting more. Thats not counting the Bow,s and arrows and getting a couple good cross bows, then there is the knives, and tomahawks, razor shop and can be thrown. Then I can most likly come up with a few more supprises for them, as Gommer Pyle word say "Surpise, Surpise, Surpise". God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out of the US My M1911 was tweaked by USMC Armorer that builds SPEC OPS weapons. I use hollow-point "HOT" loads in my M1911 so I don't need more than one per. By the way, I car pooled to the Pentagon back in the early 1990s with a USAF MAJ AP. He was tracking all USAF small arms and one morning he got into the car and said: "Hack, you aren't going to believe this..." Then he told me that the US Army had taken first delivery of 10K Berretta pistols. They had taken ten (10) pistols randomly of the cases and disassembled them on a long table. They mixed the parts up and reassembled them (this was a repeat of the 1909 tests that The Colt M1911 won.) They got six (6) back together and they functioned (some stiffly). Two (2) more were together but had one or more serious problems. The last two (2) they could NOT REASSEMBLE! Besides being a 9mm, the damn pistol sucks. I owned most of the 9mm pistols back in the mid-1960s and tested them for function/firing. The Polish Radom and Browning HP were okay. The Walter P-38 (42) was better but bulky and the Lugar almost came undone with the Israeli 9mm sub-machinegun ammo. Still not the STOPPING POWER of the .45 ACP. I even like my old Colt SAA short barrel .45 LONG better than the 9mms, but I am a cowboy at heart. I was born in Oklahoma and my Granddad had several hundred cattle on his two small spreads. I hunted and rode bareback on ponies there in the summers. On my bucket list is "Kill a Buffalo on a pony at a full gallop". Mostly I have already done the other things that might have put on that list. Now I just watch my children, grand-children, and great-grand-children explore their way through this thing we call "LIFE". Cecil S, In the field, we cooked (after skinning it) a fat rat on a splint over a fire. The fat dripped into the fire and attracted the blood-sucking bugs. Great Times! However, if you walked the beautiful avenue of downtown "Colon" outside Fort Sherman, you might have purchased one of those "critters on a stick" from the push cart chief. It might have been cat, rat, dog, snake, or ??? I think the stuff I ate was still alive. LOL In India, they have a caste of Indians that go from farm to farm to catch rats, with their hands mind you, then the build a big fire and eat the things. My lever action, is in .44 to match my pistols. It is so pretty. S&W made a nice 9mm back in the 70's, the Model 59. First one to come out with a 5 round clip, double action on first shot. Sweet gun but they stopped making them. But, hands down, the Colt .45. If you run out of ammo, you can beat them to death with it and it will still shoot. HACK43 - where do you plan to find a buffalo riding a pony? That would be akin to me riding a dog. Quick thinking david As ammo selection goes, there is something to be said for variety. Who says when the SHTF popular military calibers are all that will be available or even available at all? Get some variety, a reloading set-up, and build your cache. After all-- shooting is more about fun than it is being ready for whatever apocalypse is nearer! Perhaps the bigger zombie readiness question is can you fix your own piece when it breaks... David b, Have you ever seen "Buffalo Bill" when he was riding in his Wild West Show films? P V B - excellent question. One I think I'm going to have to put some effort and thought into. HACK43 - Yeah I've seen the films. It looked like fun. I was kidding you - the choice of "on a pony" as opposed to "from a pony" was what gave me that mental image of a BUFFALO ON A PONY. I did know what you meant, and just couldn't resist joking about it. Having served a tour in what used to be the Canal Zone, back in the mid-70s, I am also quite familiar with the stuff that one could purchase on the streets in Ciudad Panama and Colon. The Panamenos called them "beefies", and I actually found them muy sabroso. As for the javelinas, they are universally viewed with disdain, however, I recently read a piece by Bart Skelton in one of the gun magazines, that claimed there really is a way to make the little bastards pretty tasty. By-the-way, in the scheme of taxonomic classification, the javelina really is a small pig. The disgusting taste of its' meat is apparently caused by the stuff that it normally eats. Since I stated in my recent post, that the javelina really is a pig, also known as a peccary, I have provided some additional taxonomic information as follows: Kingdom: Animalia Phylum: Chordata Class: Mammalia Order: Artiodactyla Sub Order: Suina Family: Tayassuidae Genus: Tayassus Species: numerous variations Source of information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peccary NOW, can we put lipstick on it. LOL. I too looked it up on line and it seens that is the desendant of European Hogs. I know that in Texas, people just kill them, just to be killing something but I was curious about the possibility of a food source. Cecil S - Remember "Crocodile Dundee"? "It tastes like sh*t but you can live on it"? There's your answer I think - it's a protein source, not tasty, but it'll fill your belly and keep you going. (Full disclosure - I've never tasted that particular meat.) Even venison can be nasty if they're forced by nature to a survival diet. When you're hungry enough you'll probably like it. Maybe if you were to marinate it in tequila or something.... That was MY thinking too david. I feel sure that given the circumstances, they can be eaten. I am betting a lot of POWs would have gladly eaten them. BUT, not doing one for Thanksgiving. LOL I'd imagine that HACK43 would attest that when attending the Jungle Operations Training Center (JOTC), one gets to eat a lot of things that they normally might pass. Typical JOTC fare also included coatimundi, a sort of raccoon-like creature, and iguana. Now that iguana was really pretty good stuff. Fact is I used to chase them down in my yard, wring their necks, clean them up, and grill them. Iguanas can run pretty fast, but they have very little stamina and endurance, so they are easily caught by hand. Perhaps when HACK posited that javelinas might be rodents, he was actually thinking of the capybara. We used to see a lot of them down country in South America, but occasionally they made an appearance in Panama. The capybara is a really huge rodent.....like a humongous rat. I never ate one, but I saw a couple of them out in the Gamboa Forest Preserve, which is about mid-isthmus between the Pacific and Atlantic sides of the canal. That makes sense Colonel. And given that a Capy primarily eats aquatic vegetation, I'd eat one of them in a heartbeat. Care in cleaning would be necessary, as it is with all animals, but that aside, if it's eating things like rushes and cat-tails, and the water its in isn't dirty, how bad can it taste? The only downside I'd see here is that if the water is polluted some of those will concentrate in the capy's food, and doubly so in it's meat. But then, I'm not sure there is any such thing as unpolluted water these days - except maybe inside a melting glacier. AND, if you're hungry, polluted meat is better than none. Well, yeah, david b.....Ya just have to make sure the meat is well done. My experiences with cooking wild things over, or in, an open fire pretty much substantiate that you absolutely must see nothing but grey/white meat when you start cutting into the stuff. Any sort of pink meat will be putting one at risk from all kinds of parasites, microscopic and macroscopic. Canovack - isn't taxonomic how Obama is going to solve our economy? ;) Hmmmm, marinating meat in tequila........ 'Sounds interesting, PVB. I'm a Martini guy, but good old Kentucky Bourbon works too. I'd rather drink them than marinate something in them, anyway. Jack Daniels goes very well with a nice steak... Well, I'd imagine that a few slugs of Jack would help roasted coatimundi, capybara, or even javelina pass down the gullet.....as long as you drank them right before eating......and immediately after. I'm a 'Scots whisky' guy myself. Funny - I'll eat damned near anything that swims, flies, crawls or walks - but I drink pretty much (Not counting water, juices, coffee and tea...) only drink scotch - and a bit o' Irish now and then. And a few stouts and porters too, I should add. Colonel, you never cease to impress me. Where did you get to "tour" in S. America. I used to run down the West Coast of SA from time to time. I loved Colombia, Peru was OK and Chile was really neat. Spent a couple of years running into Chiriqui Grande in Panama. Not much there but Columbus was supposed to have visited on one of his voyages. They built a very nice whorehouse not far from there but some Baptist missionary got the locals to burn it down. Well, Cecil, as with most things, my wanderings around the world were really not planned.....at least not on my end. In June 1973, I was assigned to US Army Tropic Test Center located in the Canal Zone. The mission was test and evaluation of Army materiel, with a particular focus on the effects of the humid tropics. I was there for four years almost to the day. One of my projects was the Development Test of the Personnel Armor System for Ground Troops (PASGT). I mention that in passing, because my test plans and subsequent test activities and evaluation reports led directly to the adoption of the current Kevlar helmet that all of our services are now using. Now, when I wasn't involved in testing all sorts of fun things, I also spent time down country on what we used to call the "Capital Run". These were usually C141 or C130 aircraft that ran routine service to the US Embassies throughout Central and South America. Sometimes we went on official business, and sometimes we just went for the hell of it. I grew to appreciate and love Central and South America during those four years. You guys are right, maybe I was thinking about that SA rodent. By the way, forget the lipstick but DON'T pick the ugly one to "eat". I confuse easily as in the last election. I couldn't decide on whether to vote for the Scotsman (Mc'Cain) or the Irishman (O'Bama). I knew that the first of the name means "son of", I just didn't know "Bama" meant "bitch". Luckily, I personally know John McCain, he was my Senator when I lived in AZ. I voted for him. We drank coffee several times but I guess that my CUZ, David did not like him. Couldn't remember what those critters on a stick were called. Good thing about getting older, your memory fades those bad times away. Unfortunately, it fades the good times too. Did anyone hear about a COL "Jerry" Gerald Clark in SA? He was my Company CO when I had the ONLY Ground Surveillance Platoon in the US Army at Fort Hood (163 MI BN-Combat). He was killed in a strange auto accident that smelled like a hit to me. We tested all sorts of equipment at Fort Hood. We had a neat MOPAR 4X4 that was the testbed for the HUMVEEs. It had a ring mount in the overhead rollbar that we mounted a GSR. My platoon consisted of 22 3-man Sensor Teams. That was the UGS, REMS, PSIDS, and other things that went beep in the night. We were deployed to support the First CAV and Second Armored Divisions. In 1973, we were almost back-loaded onto the A/C we flew to Fort Bliss on to be sent to help Israel fight the Yon Kipper battles. Unfortunately, they sent the Hawk Missile Systems instead. That is how we got the "Improved" Hawk as we gave away the first model. I do remember in Jungle Warfare School that we ate snake, sea turtle, and chicken. But then again, almost everything tastes like chicken (except Javelina and sea turtle and maybe some other things that go beep in the night.) Always choose sea turtle to eat with or without tequila. A nice rush of memories than spans many years, fears, and friends. I still remember getting inspected by Chesty Puller at MCRD, San Diego in 1962. Meeting GEN S L A Marshall back in 1968. Meeting LTG Hal Moore at my CUZ's funeral at Arlington National Cemetery. Jumping out of a U-6A on a night equipment jump with my A-Team. We always celebrated that event as that single engine A/C is called the "Beaver". I was assigned to the ROTC Department at the University of Arizona back in the late 1970s. I sponsored the mounted unit there and once had to go down to Fort Huachuca, pickup a dozen horses, picket them overnight in a vacant Old Tucson lot, so I could mount up all the cadets in their "Black Jack" Pershing uniforms for the largest equestrian parade in the world. Almost felt like "B-Troop" and the US Army paid me on active duty to go ORIGINAL CAV. Never had a normal assignment, ALL one of a kind duties that in someway I was either "NEVER THERE" or "I DON'T RECALL THAT ..... Christ, you guys should write books. You have me in awe of your exploits and adventures. Sincerely, my hat is off to each and every one of you guys. Hack43. If you don't mind me asking, how old are you? I am 69 and the Colonel is 71. And you do remember that Gen. Patton was killed in an "auto accident". By the way, I have never eaten snake, even though we have a shitload of them in Texas and I hear they are quite good. Rattler is good, grilled especially. I'm not as fond of others, and I'm told that Cottonmouth is nasty - but they have such a nasty attitude that I wouldn't want to eat one. You guys must know how that works - if it's mean enough you stay away. (Which is why I've not had a conversation with my first wife in decades.) Anyway, cottonmouths have a limited distribution, so most of you probably won't even have to worry about them. Born in March 1943. Shot hundreds of Cottonmouths when I was a teenager and younger. My granddad had a ranch along the Red River and I walked the creeks at dust when those snakes came out to play. Had several close calls with those nasty snakes. Back on topic. The ATF wanted a publicity stunt at Waco where they lost control and many innocent civilian lives were lost. No one was ever convicted of that mass murder. Why should we expect that the Obama Administration (President on down to the agents in charge) will ever be convicted of their connection to killing just a few. By the way, how many other victims have been connected to those weapons? About 15 years ago one cottonmouth actually chased me thru some bottom land. I used a stick to toss it away a few times but it kept after me. I finally picked up a rotted piece of log close to a foot in diameter and dropped that on it - which permitted me to get away. Darned thing was as mean and tenacious as my first ex. I guess that was why the snake was the sign of those nasty Comanches back in the Republic of Texas days. David - are you sure that cottonmouth wasn't actually a senator? LOL. No, I'm not sure. But it was coming after me so doggedly and for no reason that I almost thought it was an ATF agent! (And with THAT, we're back on the original subject. Ha!) I was in Portland at the time of Waco and watch it on TV in disbelief. But then I have had dealings with ATF and DEA over the years and was not surprised. Talk about piss poor prior planning. Of course, then the super cops got involved (FBI) and ended up burning the place down. The Feds always think they are super cops cause they are well paid. They really are not as smart as they would have you believe but have loads of money (ours) to play cops and robbers with. David b, your comment about rattlers being tasty reminds me of my first attempt at cooking one. I was a young lieutenant posted at Fort McClellan, AL back in mid 1960s. Our main training area, Pelham Range, was a great place to go fishing and hunting, and on one of my outings I saw the biggest damned rattlesnake I had ever seen. It was a canebrake rattlesnake, and all I could see of it was a section of its' back. I had a .22 SA revolver with me, so I shot at what I could see, and the whole damned patch of grass it was lying in erupted as the snake literally jumped about six feet in the air, rattling all the way up and all the way down. It curled up into a huge coil, and I was able to dispatch it with a single shot to the head. When I picked it up, I had to hold it up over my head just to get its' 13 rattles clear of the ground. Now, as if that wasn't enough excitement, when I took it back to my quarters on post, I skinned and cleaned it figuring I'd fry it. Dumb!!! I put the cooking oil in the skillet and curled the snake up and dropped it in, and.....the damned thing came completely uncoiled and crawled all over the stove and onto the floor. I never figured that the muscular contractions would do that. Lesson Learned: Cut snakes into small segments before frying them. Speaking of Congress: A Deer Hunting Story... Ted Nugent, rock star and avid bow hunter from Michigan , was being interviewed by a liberal journalist, and animal rights activist. The discussion came around to deer hunting. The journalist asked, 'What do you think is the last thought in the head of a deer before you shoot him? Is it, 'Are you my friend?' or is it 'Are you the one who killed my brother?' Nugent replied, 'Deer aren't capable of that kind of thinking. All they care about is, what am I going to eat next, who am I going to screw next, and can I run fast enough to get away. They are very much like our Congress. The interview ended. I'd like to watch that interview, just to see the person's face. Do you have a link to it anywhere online? Never had rattle snake yet but hope to try it some time and never ran into a Cottonmouth either, but I have run into a King Cobra and along with some nasty pit vipers that had a bad additude, One thing we had 2 great big Pythons come a groawling in under our base camps gates one night, and the Black Sargent at the gate I was on turn totally white and kept shake me yell shoot it, when I finnally got him off me and shot it, then next morning we loaded both them up on a low boy and took the down to the village and I thought that the old fart village cheif was going to have a heart attack from danceing around he was so happy. It took less than 15 minutes for those villagers to skin and clean both snake that where 18 f00t plus long.Also I have ate alot of thing I was fed at a couple Moutian yard villages could have most anything, I learned just eat it and make out that it was good to keep our heads on our shoulders and them on our side, so only God knows what it was. The nastius snake I ran into was the Damn little 2 step Bamboo Viper. Darn thing just looks for trouble and won't quit. Reminds me of Piglousy, don't call me Ma'am Boxer and Frakinfienstien, I swear cut its head off and it will still try to figure out how to bite ya. God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out of the US Even though it kills me, I am watching the Rep. debate tonight. The only one up there I can support is Ron Paul. I would however, given a couple of drinks, try to have sex with Michelle Bachmann. I am betting that 25 years ago, she was a REAL hottie. How did she ever marry a fruit? Cecil - LMAO! I wouldn't even need the drinks. Her OR Palin would be on my 'hit it' list anytime they were nearby - better yet Bachmann AND Palin. I still like hot women, but no longer care if they're smart or not, and I'm not sure either ever was. So they're just what the doctor ordered. Ann Coulter on Fox TV is another. I wouldn't vote for either, but I'd darned sure give both of them my full-on best effort at shock and awe and at my age I can easily make it a long engagement. "Yeah, Baby, Yeah!" (quoting Austin Powers) Maybe I need another drink... Cheers! Yeah, I would do Coulter if she just wouldn't talk. Well, getting off-topic is one thing, since we have pretty well exhausted our comments and disdain for Holder, but..... I'd guess that as long as guys our age can even think about who we'd like to "do", we'll be alright. Besides the fairly balanced reporting that comes from the Fox News Network, I just flat out enjoy looking at all of those foxy ladies that Fox has as reporters..... You kow Colonel, I know we often get "off topic" but it is just so nice for me to talk to guys my age, that I can relate too in some ways (I grew up aroung the military, I am afraid of the gov't, etc), so I apologize if I have disturbed the flow of intended subject material. I have pretty much given up on ever seeing Holder or Obama punished for anything they pull. I am also so incensed over the "Insider Trading" disclosures, that my senses have been somewhat clouded this week. I will try to do better. Respectfully, Cecil It is ALL good, off or on topic. Happy Thanksgiving! Are we really off topic? After all, the article is about Holder and we've been talking quite a bit about snakes! ;) AND a little bit about 'beotches' too.... I think we got him nailed! No David - he has US nailed!!! On topic or off topic, for us old farts pretty gals are always on minds, that is why we are called dirty old men, personally I wear that title with pride!! Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours and may God Bless ya'll, and this forum, and many more to come. God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded and Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out of the US. Like HACK43, I agree that whether our chatter is on or off topic, it is all good. We do well to remember that our Second Amendment stands as the guardian of all of our freedoms, and just having a "bull session" on line that criticizes our government is truly a blessing for which we should all be grateful. Over the years that I have been active in this forum, I have learned much. I have also had the distinct privilege of getting to know some of the finest citizens that any nation could be fortunate enough to count as its' population. Warmest regards and best wishes for a Happy Thanksgiving! Hey canovack, I saw on the news that ya'll might get alittle rain down your direction this week. I sure hope so, those great white tail deer down there need it to keep grown up, like them I saw on the hunting channel this last couple week ends. I sure hope that some day I can get down there and hunt one or two some day. Happy Thanks Giving to you and yours My friend and God Bless. God Bless America and Our Troops Past Present and Future. Keeping to My Oath Locked Loaded andf Keeping My Powder Dry. Get the US Out of the UN and the UN Out of the US Well, bear1, we actually did get about a quarter inch overnight. It might not have done diddly damn to the water levels in our reservoirs, but it did help some with the grass and trees.....and it may have added a tiny bit to the stock tanks. Whatcha gonna have for dinner tomorrow? I mean that your wife can probably be pretty creative with some Native American recipes. My wife and I are in for a smoked turkey that will be prepared by the eldest (age 48) one of our six sons. He's the one who will have to get up and busy early in the morning, while my Texas Rose and I just sorta lolly gag around the house. Well canovack, our nephew on the better halves side has invited us over to his house and he's doing most of the cooking, we are doing some of the side dishies, like one of my favorites, deviled eggs. So I get to kick back and just wait for the food to get done and eat this year, lucky me, cuss I usualy smoke a turkey, and some ribs and saugages for appitizers, whitch means I am up most of the night to get it just right. that mean I also make Breakfast for everyone and the sauge is gone long before we get to dinner time. LOL I wander why? God Bless you and your sweet sweet rose and all. Happy Thanks Giving. I am getting to cook a 10 lb. rib eye roast in my Ron Popiel pocket rotisserie. Might be my Mom's last Thanksgiving so I caved and agreed to have the dinner at our place. Wishing all of my friends and your families a Happy Thanksgiving, I remain, Respectfully, Cecil Happy Thanksgiving all! Happy Thanks Giving to you also Cecil. Maybe you ot to try and putting one of them roast in a smoker ome time. Good stuff! just a suggestion. God Bless You and Yours. We lost Mom in last of Aug. So give you Mom a Big Hug while you can. thanks bear. She is 89, my Dad died 4 years ago. I have been taking care of them for 9 years now. I miss my Dad every day and I will give her a hug. I have thought about the smoker thing, just haven't tried it. BUT, that Showtime roaster is the best thing I have ever purchased from the TV. You truly do, just set it and forget it. I have cooked lots of stuff in in and they always turn out perfectly. Haven't tried the pocket fisherman though. Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family. Cecil God Bless you for what you're doing Cecil. I know it's not easy. When I was younger my folks got sick way too early - Mom had cancer, Dad heart disease. I lived 50 miles away and spent nearly every other weekend for 8 years at their place - and near the end every weekend. Then they both up and left for a better place in the same year. I was 32 at the time. God Bless all of y'all on Thanksgiving. Be thankful for your families especially. As Dirty Harry says, A Man's Gotta Do What A Man'g Gotta Do. They took care of me for many years and the Orientals do it, so...... And Bless you too David. Happy Thanksgiving. Best wishes to all for a meaningful Thanksgiving day of home pleasures with family and all the goodies to eat and drink. My Rose and I are the oldies in our families, since both of our parents are gone. My dad was 88 when he departed in 1999. My wife's dad was 83 when he left in 2003. My mom hung on until she was 96 and left in 2009, and my mom-in-law just left us at 89 last May. Anyway, death is a part of life.....a life for which I thank God every morning when I roll out of the rack. Every day above ground is a good one, and it's better to be on top of the grass mowing it.....that to be under the grass growing it. Happy Thanksgiving to all..... An Important Note for GunReports.Com Readers: Our goal on this website is to foster a free expression of views while reining in language that crosses the line of civil discourse. Accordingly, the comments areas are intended to expand the knowledge of all users of this site. But site administrators wish to discourage the use of profanity, insults, disrespect, the advocacy of lawlessness, violence or sedition, or attempts to impinge on the rights of others. While GunReports.Com encourages robust discourse that furthers our understanding of all the issues affecting gun owners, comments that break GunReports.Com’s rules will be removed. 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