Reader Comments
Funny the TV station didn't contact any christian church to get their reaction. I personally don't do business with mooslims for the very same reason.
Comment by: Robert B | October 28, 2011
I am a Texas CHL Instructor also. I think Mr. Keller's radio ad was out of line for broadcast over the public airwaves. I hope nothing comes of this but, we all must be accountable for our words and actions.
Comment by: MoJo | November 3, 2011
what about his right of freedom of speech. Oh I forgot white, chrisian americans don't have rights
Comment by: Buzz C | November 3, 2011
Welcome to America, where you not only have the right to carry a concealed firearm, but also to be a non-christian. The rabid religious right has gotten to be a laughable group of idiots. Guys like this are a perfect spokesperson for the stupidity that they spout. Scream and yell about your rights and your freedoms, but if anyone thinks differently than you, you sure don't mind trampling all over their rights.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
Finally a man stands up for what he believes and the Government is investigating him? I see nothing wrong with his position. Liberals should not be trusted with a gun since they have demonstrated a lack of common sense. and for Muslims...well, there are 2 kinds of Muslims, those who follow the Qur'an (called terrorists) and those who claim to be moderate Muslims (those who do not follow the Qur'an). Basically if a Muslim closely follows the Qur'an and it's tenants then they cannot exist in a Democratic Republic such as These United States of America because the Qur'an commands them to impose Sharia Law and kill, subvert or convert the citizens...(that is you and me).
The so-called moderate Muslims are those who do NOT closely follow the Qur'an and therefore not "real" Muslims. Since Muslims must impose Sharia Law and that requires the overthrow of our Republic then this man is simply not selling to potential terrorists. I guess Texas officials see Islam as a religion when it is nothing but a politically oriented cult.
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 3, 2011
Finally a man stands up for what he believes and the Government is investigating him? I see nothing wrong with his position. Liberals should not be trusted with a gun since they have demonstrated a lack of common sense. and for Muslims...well, there are 2 kinds of Muslims, those who follow the Qur'an (called terrorists) and those who claim to be moderate Muslims (those who do not follow the Qur'an). Basically if a Muslim closely follows the Qur'an and it's tenants then they cannot exist in a Democratic Republic such as These United States of America because the Qur'an commands them to impose Sharia Law and kill, subvert or convert the citizens...(that is you and me).
The so-called moderate Muslims are those who do NOT closely follow the Qur'an and therefore not "real" Muslims. Since Muslims must impose Sharia Law and that requires the overthrow of our Republic then this man is simply not selling to potential terrorists. I guess Texas officials see Islam as a religion when it is nothing but a politically oriented cult.
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 3, 2011
sorry for the double post...
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 3, 2011
He wasn't making a political statement or protest ad, he was advertising his business. So how does his freedom of speech come into play? And why is his freedom of speech and more important that anyone elses right to freedom of religion? Or freedom to vote a full Democratic party ticket? Why is it when someone has a different point of view their rights become less important? Why is that any different than saying "I won't teach black people either"? If a Muslim instructor had an ad that said he won't teach christians, would you really feel the same way? Would he still have you there to defend his right to say that? Covering racism up by calling it freedom of speech is un-American.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
It's terrific when a true American takes a firm stand against non-American nonsense. It can only do our country good. Get those government goons out of our business and this country would begin to thrive once again.
Comment by: Sirlin | November 3, 2011
If we could have only been so lucky that the flight trainers in the US would have used the same idea as Mr Keller to help prevent the two planes flying into the world trade center on 9/11. Stay firm sir!
Comment by: huntin man | November 3, 2011
Well....I guess now ALL restaurants, bars, businesses ect. must do away with signs that read, "We Reserve The Right To Refuse Service To Anyone?"
Granted...he should have been a little more covert...but...I applaud him for standing up for who he chooses to teach or more importantly, not to teach. AND...The Texas Department of Public Safety needs to keep there nose out of it or start telling all those restaurants, bars, businesses ect. that they DON'T have the right to refuse service to anyone. Let's see how the hell that goes over!!!
Kindest Regards....
In God We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
Well....I guess now ALL restaurants, bars, businesses ect. must do away with signs that read, "We Reserve The Right To Refuse Service To Anyone?"
Granted...he should have been a little more covert...but...I applaud him for standing up for who he chooses to teach or more importantly, not to teach. AND...The Texas Department of Public Safety needs to keep there nose out of it or start telling all those restaurants, bars, businesses ect. that they DON'T have the right to refuse service to anyone. Let's see how the hell that goes over!!!
Kindest Regards....
In God We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
@Buzz C. I am not a fan of any religious extremism, including Christian, but I fail to see your point. Mr. Keller is not trying to remove the right of Muslims to receive the training...he is simply saying he will not provide it. That would seem to me to be his right.
Comment by: Dcarg | November 3, 2011
OOPS...how did that double post?? HMMM...sorry about that...
Kindesst Regards...
In God We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
You don't have the right to refuse service to anyone based on religion or race. If you believe the validity of the rights of American citizens depends on their race, religion, or political affiliation, you might as well just take out the Bill of Rights and piss all over it. THAT'S un-American.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
@GLENN A.... What if you came into my land surveying business and I said "Sorry Glenn...I just don't like you. But the surveyor down the road might, go to him?" Now prove that my decision was based on religion or race ect...bet you'd have a hard time. Businesses still practice this sadly...I've seen it first hand.
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
I am looking at this gun shop now to buy a gun. I will support his right to deny training to ANY person he thinks is unfit to own a gun. I personally don't like redheads so I won't train them. Maybe I should add skinny people to that list...or people who drive a Prius. Yea, that will work for me. I remember a time when wearing a beard was bad and would get you kicked out of many places. Who gives a damn? Mind your own business and stop messing with everyone else.
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 3, 2011
Mr, Keller has the right to refuse to teach anyone he wishes for any reason as long as he doesn't publish it. By publishing his prejudices he leaves himself open to all sorts of civil rights laws. Also by putting this out on the airwaves he leaves DPS in a very tenuous situation. Folks will start to ask does DPS condone this kind of advertising?
Comment by: MoJo | November 3, 2011
@Geometric: The problem is he isn't saying he doesn't like someone, he is saying that he will refuse service based on religion or race. That is illegal, and un-American. Try to follow the bouncing ball, M'kay?
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
@Geometric. Where is the line between the rights of someone to receive a service and the right of someone to not provide that service?
Comment by: Dcarg | November 3, 2011
Mr. Keller has the right to serve whomever he wants in his own private business. And last time I checked he has the right to freedom of speech. And I for one, agree wholeheartedly with his decision! It's high time all of us stood up to our would be tyrannical government and exercised our rights with some plain old fashioned common sense!
Comment by: Wade P | November 3, 2011
Part of being an FFL or a CHL instructor is the instructions that "You MAY NOT sell or transfer a firearm or ammunition to any person you know or have reasonable cause to believe is prohibited from possessing or receiving a firearm. Do not sell or otherwise transfer a firearm and do not contact NICS if you have reason to believe that a person seeking to obtain a firearm is prohibited from receiving or possessing a firearm." The only problem Mr. Keller made for himself is the NON-PC advertisement on the radio. I liked the ad, have like feelings & as a FFL would personally exercise my right to refuse to sell to a person whom I felt was not legally able to possess a firearm. Therefore, he would not be able to take the class.
Comment by: LARRY J | November 3, 2011
Once again the law abiding gun owner / citizen is slammed by those who don't have a clue about anything other than their own biased opionion. I see nothing wrong with the add, it is his freedom of speech. Had he been muslim or non Christian you can bet nothing would have been said. Come on DPS, were on your side.
Comment by: Rod H | November 3, 2011
What we need is a Constitutional amendment to outlaw the practice of Sharia law in the United States. Of course, so much of Sharia law (like murdering your daughter) is already illegal, but we need a clear statement here. Too many short-sighted appeasers.
Comment by: Mister E | November 3, 2011
@GLENN A... I followed along just fine thanks...that's why I said in my previous post that "he should have been a little more covert." Prejudices still exist Glenn...some are just harder to prove than others. But you gotta admit this guy's got extremely large balls and/or he's just a little bit touched?? LMAO!!!!
Kindest Regards...
In God We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
@Dcarg... The rights of someone to provide or not to provide a service has and ALWAYS will be at that service providers sole discretion.
Kindest Regards...
In God We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
No, Geo, not when that decision is based on race or religion. That is and ALWAYS has been illegal.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
I believe that most of you are missing the point. This is not about opinion, it's about the law. This is not Mr. Keller's private business. Mr. Keller has been certified by the state of Texas to administer a handgun proficiency course in accordance with Texas GC §411.188, HANDGUN PROFICIENCY REQUIREMENT. Texas GC §411.172, ELIGIBILITY, Provides all of the requirements that a person must meet to be eligible for a license to carry a concealed handgun in the state of Texas. These requirements are prescribed by the state of Texas and are not subject to modification by any handgun proficiency course instructor.
Comment by: k228250 | November 3, 2011
It seems that YOU are missing the point as you see to ignore what the FFL above has already stated as part of the TX FFL's responsiblity. "You MAY NOT sell or transfer a firearm or ammunition to any person you know or have reasonable cause to believe is prohibited from possessing or receiving a firearm. Do not sell or otherwise transfer a firearm and do not contact NICS if you have reason to believe that a person seeking to obtain a firearm is prohibited from receiving or possessing a firearm." Mr. Keller has reason to believe these people are "prohibited". Deal with it! Go Mr. Keller!
Comment by: Wade P | November 3, 2011
@GLENN.... I KNOW that Glenn...I have been in business for over 35 years man. But proving that you have decided/denied a service based on race or religion is very difficult in court. Unless, you come right out and say it like this guy did! I'm not saying it's right, but it happens who knows how many thousands of times a day. I don't like what the Muslim religion stands for nor do I like ANY extremist way of thinking. But that doesn't mean that I would deny anyone of his or her rights to the services I provide BASED on those rights. If Mohamed came into my shop... I'd say I take cash or credit cards.
Kindest Regards...
In GOD We Trust...
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
NOW...excuse me while I go and eat my TEXAS B-B-Q PORK RIBS!!! LMAO!!!!
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
Wade, based on what? Your prejudices? If someone is Arab, you ASSUME they are "prohibeted" from owning a gun? You're just another ignorant racist, and people like you intent on denying other American citizens their rights and freedoms are PART OF THE PROBLEM!
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
I see no commonly arrived at conclusion to this argument, and that's very likely the way it should be. We all have opinions, and we aren't all going to agree about certain things. One thing that I believe is certain here, is that Mr. Keller likely has stated something with which all of us can privately identify. That said, federal and state laws come into play here, because Mr. Keller is acting as an agent of the government when he certifies his students as qualified concealed handgun carriers. It is that relationship that likely has piqued the interest of the TX DPS.
Comment by: canovack | November 3, 2011
I want to make a few points here: 1) He has a right to free speech.
2) If he wants to keep his instructor's license, he probably can't discriminate - as state law will likely indicate, and if not it would probably be trumped by federal laws against discrimination. Same for his FFL. You submit to the applicable laws when you apply for any kind of state-issued 'authority' via a license or permit. To his credit, he did state that he'd give up his license rather than change his mind. Maybe he should do that.
3) As for his discrimination - it was not just about Muslims, was it? He included anyone who's politics he doesn't like - and presumably, since he specified people's voting record, he will ask about that. How many of you would like to be kicked out of my (non-existing, btw) gun shop because you voted for Bush and I think that makes you possibly mentally defective? (the second letter in AWOL is 'dubya')
4) As for proving his discrimination in court - he's already made it public, hasn't he? All that is required now is for someone to go in with a few witnesses and ask to buy a gun and be trained so that he can defend his mosque. Or to say that he's afraid of all those foaming at the mouth neocons. Then he gets kicked out, or Mr. Keller proves himself to be a loud-mouth ass who won't back up his talk. Public statements and witnesses to prove he follows up on what he said will get him convicted of discrimination.
5) Free speech doesn't cover up for trying to deprive other citizens of their rights under the Constitution. If you are violating The Constitution you are an enemy of the nation. No ifs, ands, or buts. Most of us took an oath to protect and defend that Constitution "against all enemies, DOMESTIC and foreign". If you did, then keep it. I keep mine.
Comment by: david b | November 3, 2011
I fully support Mr. Keller's decision. GOD BLESS AMERICA !!! Oh, and DON'T mess with TEXAS !
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 3, 2011
Amazing to me that there are so many people that support somebody denying other people their 2nd amendment rights. I though this was a pro-gun website??
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
Item ONE: Glenn, you ignorant troll.
Item TWO: That was the best $175 ever spent in the history of media advertisement.
Comment by: RackEmPunk | November 3, 2011
RackEmPunk: If i'm an ignorant troll, you're an inbred jackass.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
See how much easier it is to just call names and walk away rather than trying to make a point? You know, all troll-like?
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 3, 2011
Good for him. He has the right to refuse service to anyone.
Comment by: Utah Dealer | November 3, 2011
Utah Dealer - if the state is threatening to take his license to teach, he apparently does NOT have that right. OR, one might say he has the right, but not the ability to continue to offer the service to the others. Our opinions really don't matter when it comes to the law now, do they? IF the state license folks think he's discriminating, he's likely going to be out of that business.
We all have an opinion on this, belly buttons and a55-$&%_s too. But those don't really matter, other than it makes us feel good to vent them (all of them). If he's in violation of the state's rules for his business, he'll lose his license to teach. If he's really discriminating, he could lose a lot of business too. It's a risk he takes. Based on what he said about being willing to give up teaching rather than teach muslims, I guess he's willing to take that hit. For that, I have to give him a certain amount of respect, even though I personally think his prejudices are ridiculous and ignorant.
Comment by: david b | November 3, 2011
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Comment by: ord03 | November 3, 2011
I know...Let's all run over to any Muslim controlled country and start a forum like this and ask them if they think that Muslims in that country and the good ol' US of A should all have a CWP!!?? That ought to do it??!!!
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
oops...that should have read...ask them if they think that Muslims or Americans in that country and the good ol' US of A should all have a CWP!!??
Comment by: Geometric1 | November 3, 2011
To Glenn A. The muslim faith is a sataniclly inspired religous lie. They would cut your head off first! Our userper in chief is one. His claim to be a christian is a lie directly from its originator Lucifer. Keep defending a lie and you'll get to spend eternity with them,
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
To Glenn A. Keep defending a lie and you'll get to spend eternity with the muslims. Allah is not the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob. The only way for man to GOD is through the Son, the way, the truth and the life! Their whole faith is a lie directly from the father of lies, Lucifer. Allah is none other than Lucifer himself. The Word of God says he is the god of this world. You can thank Adam for that. As for the Democratic party to which I once belonged. It has been hijacked by a bunch of marxist socialist. I don't think that all the moderate and conservative democrats have died off have they? They should be sufficiently pissed off enough by now to take their party back. Anyone who calls themselves Christian and votes for immoral canidates from any party WILL stand befpre Almighty God one day and give an account. May the Father of Yeshua abundantly bless Crockett Keller! god bless America and help us take it back from the evil that rules it today!
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
Racer8c - That's quite a mouthful you just put up there. But if you take your own advice about who Christians should vote for, you must stay home on election day, right? I don't think a full-on Christian would even run for office. (Just trying to understand your position, you know?)
Comment by: david b | November 4, 2011
To Racer8c: Wow. You've almost proven my point for me. Do you think your statement makes you sound well-educated and informed, or ignorant and half-insane? (I'll give you a hint-it's behind door number 2)
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 4, 2011
Oh, and by the way, if you think the muslim faith is based on lies, you should really do some research about your own faith, christianity. You won't, I'm sure, because you are too caught up in blindly clinging to your dogma, but if you ever want to know the truth, it's out there.
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 4, 2011
I have all the research I need. The King James version of The Holy Bible, researched and translated from the original greek, arabic and hebrew transcripts. Get a Strongs Exhaustive Concordance and you can find the original meaning of any verse in The Holy Word. If it doesn't align itself with that it is a lie. And yes,I am clinging to my faith, guns and money.
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
The BIBLE?? THAT'S your research?? A book commisioned by Pope Constantine (formerly a high priest of the Sol Invicta pagan faith) over 400 years after the death of Jesus? A book that touted jesus's divinity, even though there was NO mention of Jesus being any more than a mortal man for the prior 400 years??? THAT'S YOUR PROOF???? Keep clinging, buddy, keep clinging. Reality wouldn't agree with you. (By the way, don't ask yourself why you have so many pagan symbols in your religious holidays, it'll just confuse you)
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 4, 2011
My, my, tsk, tsk.....If we ever want to get into a brouhaha, all that is needed is to get into an argument about religion. While I am a believer and a Christian, I categorically refuse to get into an argument with anybody over religious differences. When entering the arena of religious dissent, about the best we can all do is to agree to disagree, and leave it at that. There is just no good reason to get all jacked out of shape, increasing our blood pressure in the process, all because we don't all believe exactly the same thing.....
Comment by: canovack | November 4, 2011
To david b, I hear what you are saying. I once was one of satans best foot soldiers but I had a close encounter of the God kind setting at a stop sign in the country one day. He asked me a question that changed my life not to mention scared the crap out of me. He opened my spiritual eyes to my true state and I was very very ashamed. The problem is that believers have sat back and done nothing for so long we now have an incredible mess. He asked me why He blessed me to live in a country where I was free to vote for my leaders and I wasn't taking advantage of it. After that He showed me as a believer in His Son that it was my moral duty to vote for the most morally responsible canidate. If said canidate lies about his morality I have done my duty but said canidate will stand in judgment before Him one day and give an account. Abortion is murder and I'm guilty of that. Homosexuality is just plain wrong! Anyone with a modicum of sense should be able to see that it is a violation of the laws of nature. Thanks be to God I am not guilty of that. But even if I was it doesn't matter anymore, I've been forgiven. I have no control of my past, only my future. About the full on Christian running for office. The Word says that the governments of this world are controlled by satan. That does not mean that we should just sit by and watch evil rule. We must take up the fight. Being the hell raiser I once was, in this system I wouldn't be able to even get my name on the ballot. But there are devoted believers who do run and should have our support. He that dwells in me has overcome the world but the world doesn't understand the new creature and would never forgive someones past. Glenn A suffers from spiritual blindness. I pray God opens Glenn A's spiritual eyes as He did mine before it is to late. God wishes for no one to perish but for all to come to the saving knowledge of His Son.
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
To Glenn A, Your ignorance is a testament to your rebelliousness. Constantine started the holy roman church known today as the catholic church and he had nothing to do with the bible. My church started the moment the stone was rolled away and Jesus walked out of the tomb alive! My church has no denominational name. The church is not a building, it's the body of Christ or we His disciples. Pray the Father give His Spirit to dwell in you and as the word says The Spirit will lead you into all Truth. Your mind cannot fathom how bad eternity in the lake of fire will be. I'll pray for your poor wretched soul.
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
"My church started the moment the stone was rolled away and Jesus walked out of the tomb alive!"......Ah, yeah, just a heads up, that never happened. That "rose from the dead" stuff was an from old tale about a Pagan god named Ishtar, and it was Ishtar's name that translated to us as "Easter". Look it up. (Or don't. Some people are comforted by their ignorance.)
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 4, 2011
And, you are incorrect regarding the history of the bible, Constantine commissioned the writting of the first bible in the 4th century. That's right, nearly 400 years after the death of that Jesus dude. You don't even know that yet you cling to that book so blindly?
Comment by: KCSHOOTER | November 4, 2011
Glenn A...restating a lie does not make it true. Your lack of knowledge on the subject is obvious and I have no doubt that YOU believe it. Do not confuse the writing of the various books with the assembly into the Bible. Your time frame is simply wrong.
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 4, 2011
This is hardly a place for people to spout their personal religious views. I myself AM a Christian, and I find that kind of fundamentalist "bible thumping" offensive. Let's talk GUNS !
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 4, 2011
Thank you Gray2Hairs, I got on here to read about a true patriot that was doing what was his God given right to do but I read the muslim defenders lie in an earlier posting and the Spirit moved in me to say something. All the transcripts were written before Constantine even existed, just not assembled into the sixty six books in one we have today. As for people who claim to be Christian but complain about someone speaking the truth and call it bible thumping Jesus called you lukewarm and said that he would spew you from His mouth. And to be an atheist such as Glenn A seems to be requires even more faith than trusting the Lord. God gave us the right to keep and bear arms and if this country doesn't turn back to Him we will lose that right. 2 Chronicles 7:14. Just because you don't believe it doesn't mean it's not true.
Comment by: Racer8c | November 4, 2011
Muzzlepuncher, I have to agree with you. In my post of 4 November, about 8 comments above, I posited that religious arguments are usually fruitless ventures. We all have our views concerning religion, and as I said above, the best we can hope to do is agree to disagree. While I have been guilty of posting some-off topic comments in the past, the one subject I have studiously avoided is religion. All one has to do is read the posts in this thread to understand why I have avoided the topic. It gets pretty crazy, and in some cases it gets pretty nasty, and there is no reason for it to get that way in a forum of believers in the Second Amendment. I think it is safe to say that we are all believers in the Bill of Rights.....Isn't it?
Comment by: canovack | November 4, 2011
OMG ! "Jesus" has called me "lukewarm" and said he will spew me from his mouth. Yep, that's yer "loving" Christian God, alright....
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 4, 2011
'See what I mean? No further comment is needed.
Comment by: canovack | November 5, 2011
Let's see now. We've gone from a discussion of whether Mr. Keller has the right to discriminate in who he is going to sell a gun to and train for a Texas CCW (he does) versus whether such discrimination is legal (probably not), to who in this forum is in league with Satan versus who is a believer in Godly truth. I was just discussing this issue with Odin the other day, and he is just about ready to whomp all of y'all who are unbelievers in Him. A rational discussion of religion is one thing, a polemic screed is quite another. Any one side or t'other always believes that they have the "revealed truth" because their side says so. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, and only that.
Anybody remember the old joke about the astronaut who flies so far away that he reaches heaven? When he gets back everyone is asking about God. What did he look like? What did he have to say? So the astronaut reports: Well, first of all, She's black.
Comment by: Visigoth52 | November 6, 2011
@ Visigoth Oh you're a funster !
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 6, 2011
As I stated above, arguments about religious beliefs serve no useful purpose. So.....One more time.....The best we can do is agree to disagree and put this whole emotional and unwinnable battle to rest. This little tempest in the teacup that we see here pales with insignificance when we look back through history at all of the wars, conflicts, and suffering brought about by.....differences of opinion and beliefs in religion. It just isn't worth the effort.
Comment by: canovack | November 6, 2011
@ canovack I totally agree with you. I am of the belief that our beautiful world, and our oftentimes NOT so beautiful human race was created by GOD. BUT religion was created by MAN, and therein lies the problem. Just sayin'...
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 6, 2011
Well stated..... While religion may serve a purpose for some people, I have found, over almost 71 years, that religion is pretty much a business.....big business. That said, if folks want to engage in it, they are certainly free to do so. As for me, I do acknowledge the higher power, and my wife and I view our practice of recognizing God as a personal and private matter, with no need of a businessman who calls himself a minister, priest, rabbi, or whatever.....
Comment by: canovack | November 6, 2011
Perfectly put ! And in keeping with our GOD given fundamental right to freedom : "I may not agree with your opinion(s), but I will defend to death your RIGHT to have one !" But NEVER confuse opinions with facts.
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 6, 2011
Ahh.....yes! Do I hear the echo of Voltaire, or was it Rousseau?
Comment by: canovack | November 6, 2011
Yes, is right ! Although Rousseau was a much better hockey player than Voltaire. Rousseau played for the Montreal Canadians.
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 6, 2011
Surely you jest!..... I was referring to the French scholars and philosophers Voltaire and Rousseau who championed the concepts of freedom from oppression in Revolutionary France.
Comment by: canovack | November 6, 2011
Ha! Ha! I was most definitely jesting...Montreal Canadians LOL !
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 6, 2011
As a kid, I spent my teen years from 1950-1960 living near Detroit. The sports teams that represented Detroit were, by and large, abysmal..... While Tigers baseball was OK, Lions football routinely sucked. The only really successful team we had was the Red Wings hockey team, and our arch rival was the Montreal Canadiens.
Comment by: canovack | November 7, 2011
I'll bet Ann Arbor or Ypsilanti. I'm in Toronto and our Maple Leafs haven't won the Stanley Cup since 1967 !!! My patience is wearing thin,to say the least. Michigan is a great State. I have an Uncle that was born in Motor City.
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 7, 2011
I lived in Dearborn, but I attended Eastern Michigan University in Ypsilanti, graduating in 1963. Used to spend some time in Windsor, and have driven through the western provinces on my way to Alaska and back. Also spent time with Canadian Forces at Sainte Hubert near Montreal when I was US Delegate to the Quadripartite Treaty.
Comment by: canovack | November 7, 2011
Er, ah, guys... drifting a bit off subject, are we??
Jest sayin'
Comment by: JMass_M14 | November 8, 2011
Er, ah, guys... drifting a bit off subject, are we??
Jest sayin'
Comment by: JMass_M14 | November 8, 2011
The picture shown with the article shows what appears to be an intelligent-looking individual, not some "Red-Neck", ignorant of the law and his responsibilities as a certified instructor. My take on this whole thing: what better way to generate a ton of new business during a 'slow-down' or 'down-turn' than making an obnoxious, controversial statement publicly such as he just did, knowing full well the subsequent fallout that would be generated?
In other words, I think he did this on purpose to help his business, simple as that.
(hope this one doesn't double-post...)
JM
Comment by: JMass_M14 | November 8, 2011
Yeah JMass, we sometimes drift here. It comes with some of the friendships we form after several years of posting in this forum.
By-the-way, my morning paper had an article about Mr. Keller. In essence, he has recanted his statements, and DPS has backed off of his possible decertification. So, we are left to draw our own conlusions as to his methods of self expression.....
Comment by: canovack | November 8, 2011
I still see Mr. Keller's point and support him training WHO he chooses too. There is WAYYY too much government interference in our lives today, and there is a growing anti- gun movement out there that would take all our guns away from us if given the chance. SUPPORT FREEDOM !
Comment by: Muzzlepuncher 7 | November 8, 2011
As I read through these posts, I wonder if anyone realizes that Mr. Keller has no less rights than we do. We are free to post our pride and our predujices without fear of arrest or retaliation here. Why should Mr. Keller be any different whether written or spoken?. Of course he must face the chance that his license WILL be revoked by the same folks that let the problems at Fort Hood prevail.I'm sure there are instructors that would love to train terrorists or miscreants. It doesn't have to be Mr. Keller. LOL Our whole political correctness priorities are inane. If we offend our enemy, too bad. Semper Fi
Comment by: Sharps | November 24, 2011
Sharps - the problem isn't that he's refused to teach terrorists - he didn't. He's refused to teach any American citizen with political views he doesn't like, and "non-Christian Arabs". Not a word about terrorists. Flip to the top of the page and see what it says.
I suppose he is free to teach whom he chooses, but as we as a nation have passed laws opposing discrimination he is subject to those laws. So if he loses his licensing, that's too bad - if you can't pay the price, don't eat the rice. American citizens chose to have those laws passed by electing and re-electing the representatives who voted for them. We can toss those folks out of office (most of them are probably replaced by now anyway) and vote for candidates who'll rescind them - but don't hold your breath for those to win.
You probably wouldn't like hearing some guy refuse to teach military veterans would you? Or refusing to teach 'conservatives' who voted for the 'I wanna be a war chief and fight the terrorizers' president, would you? But you're saying it's OK for him to go the other way? Is that what I'm reading? It's like saying "I want to be sure that anyone who's politics I don't agree with is disarmed". I cannot and never would support that statement because it would leave us with a one-party system (like the Baath party), and THAT in itself would destroy the freedoms on which this nation is based.
Comment by: david b | November 25, 2011
David B...every day Christians are told they cannot even practice as simple a task as wear a anything with a Cross on it. We are not allowed to practice the religion this country was founded on. So we have already lost many of our rights. Yes there are laws preventing discrimination. So when a drug users applies for a job we have to hire them? When an enemy of this country (every devout Muslim is and enemy, their Qur'an tells them that) why should I have to provide any service to them? This is just more politically correct crap and it is about time to stop being beat up by so-called PC laws.
Besides, if you listened to the interview this guy gave it was intended to be joke and was aimed at his neighbors. Everyone needs to just stop worrying about what other people do and take care of your own stuff. It may not be legal but a lot of people agree with the concept.
Comment by: Gray2Hairs | November 25, 2011
Gray2Hairs - You are reading things into my comment that I did not say. If you don't like the concept of "PC" (and I personally hate it because it's used against free speech AND truth), then make that a priority item in your selection of candidates for Congress so that it gets changed. I'm only pointing out that we have certain laws, he's free to violate them, but then he will pay the price. I don't necessarily support 'PC' for any reason - it protects people in the workplace who should be fired and threatens the job of anyone who complains about that.
And why would I bother to listen to any interview? I don't really care about this guy's issues. First of all I'm a liberal, and he has singled me out to be among the people he wouldn't teach (not that I need it or even live near him), so he's calling me an enemy and supporting disarmament for anyone who doesn't share his political views - ME in this case. Second, any butt-wipe can change his story after the news goes viral and then claim he was joking for his neighbors. So was he lying for purposes of damage control? Maybe. I'd say probably, in an attempt to protect his license. I really don't care. He also said he was willing to pay that price. Done deal.
I understand you don't like being discriminated against in the name of non-discrimination, and I don't either. But fight it with your vote and your speech, don't just complain to the white christian male choir. It's the only way. I've paid the price a few times for speaking the truth. When its important, I still do. It's an expensive luxury, to be sure. And please don't go ranting at me about things I did not write. And try to remember - if you're old enough - an America where conservatives weren't arming themselves to attack their Democrat neighbors and relatives. I still remember that - and I want it back.
Comment by: david b | November 26, 2011
Mr. Keller: " Well said, and God Bless America"! We need more like you.
Comment by: Cali Gal | February 2, 2012
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